That's It I Quit... more thoughts from a big sissy...

Please tell what happened and how it might have been avoided. Names should be ommitted. This forum should help others learn from mistakes that caused or nearly caused a mishap.
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Gayle Ellett
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That's It I Quit... more thoughts from a big sissy...

Post by Gayle Ellett »

That’s it, I quit. This sport is just too gnarly. Over the years I’ve had about six friends get killed flying hang gliders or paragliders. Its just too depressing and heavy. For me, seeing the dark side of flying just takes all the fun out of it.

Flying has been good to me personally. Sure, in the past fifteen years of soaring I’ve had one big crash where I broke both my arms in half. But the rest of the time has been filled with the greatest moments one can imagine: Flying my Falon over the top of Mount Whitney, jumping off the cliffs of Yosemite twenty times, ridge soaring the coastal cliffs of New Zealand, Mexico, and California, etc. All those trips we’ve taken to Baja twice a year have been really fun!! Go Team ODAS (you know who you are)!! I remember the old days, back when I started, how people would do aerobatics, and evern loops, when they’d come out to the LZ. Back when Dino was a regular fixture in the club. When we used to race motorcycles in the LZ, and when I accidently set the gezebo on fire, during one of our “Flaming Paper Airplane Races�. Boy, those were good times!!

I’ve been lucky to have been taught by Joe Greblo, and to have learned a conservative style of flying. In fifteen years of soaring, and over 500 hours of air-time, I never moved away from a beginner single-surface glider, to a more difficult to fly double-surface glider. Though I was constantly teased, and told many times in the LZ by beer-soaked pilots that double-surface blade wings are “just as easy to fly as a Falcon�…I always knew they were full of shit. These were often the same people who would tell me that hang gliding was no more dangerous then driving a car. But, in fact, hang gliding is many hundreds of times more dangerous: each year, one in a thousand hang glider pilots dies flying. And that’s in a sport where the average US pilot only flys less then 20 hours a year.

But having seen a pilot die in front of me in Mexico, and hearing about Richard Seymour and Jeff Craig getting killed…its just all too depressing for a sissy like me. Richard and Jeff were both really great guys. So I’ve decided to hang up my hang-strap. For me, its just not fun any more. You’ll still see me in the LZ mooching beers off my pals, but my flying days are over.

I just want to encourage you all to fly safely, be careful, and error on the side of caution.

Gayle Ellett

----------------MORE THOUGHTS ON SAFETY----------------

Hi Guys, As a former “Safety Director� of the SHGA Club (and a highly opinionated know-it-all), I thought I’d share more of my rambling thoughts about safety.

I think there are two main compenents to flying safely.
On the one hand…there is the “physical environment�: the LZ, the Take-Off area, and the mountains and powerlines in between. Maybe the wash could be re-graded and widened, etc. But probably the physical environment is about as safe as we can legally make it.
On the other hand…we have the “pilot� part of the equation. And I believe that very little can be done here too, because people rarely change! But I do think some aspects are worth talking about, even if no one really listens.
One thing a pilot can do to improve their safety is to fly an easier glider. Yes,,,people will tease you mercilessly and call you a fagot. I know this first hand, and it stinks. But you’ll be safer. I say this because it's the hot-shot “expert� Hang IVs that do nearly all the crashing, not the students who have basically no experience. To grossly paraphrase a line from the movie “Repo Man�…�The more you fly, the stupider you get�!! And in hang gliding this seems to be true. The next time you’re drinking beer in the LZ watching folks land…you’ll see that nearly all of the wacks, broken downtubes and crashes occur on the grassy Hang IV part of the LZ…NOT where the inexperienced students land down in the wash!! Why is this? Is it really true that the more you fly, the dumber you get? Yes, I think so. I think the number-one factor here is the glider style the pilot chooses to fly: Most Hang IVs are flying gliders beyond their skill level (even thought they have a lot of skill), whereas the students are forced to fly beginner gliders. There is something very wrong with the decisions that Hang IVs are making…if the students do a better job of landing then us hot-shots/super-pilots!! I believe that if you break a down tube once a year, or even once every few years, that you are not skilled enough to be doing what you’re doing safely! Landings that end up with a bent down tube are CRASHES, not “rough landings�, as many people like to call them. They are crashes. If you’ve slammed your glider so hard into the ground that it can’t be flown again without structural repairs…that’s called a “crash�. If you landed an airplane, and sheared a wheel off, everyone would call that a crash and you’d be correctly labeled as an incompetent menace. Landings that occasionally result in a bent downtube are the type of landing (crashing) that can end up breaking your arm or killing you. I say if you’ve bent a downtube in the last year or two…you need to quickly get much much better at landing, or get an easier glider…or at least stop telling your friends and family that you are doing everything you can to fly safely, because you’d be lying. So I strongly encourage people to step down one level in the gliders they fly. But are people willing to do this? Yes…some have already.

Another pilot problem I’ve seen is called “denial�. And it is very popular at the Club. A lot of pilots say “I’m safer then that guy who crashed…because I won’t make the dumb mistakes he made, so I am shielded from accidents�. But you know what? That’s the same thing that Richard and Jeff said…and now they’re dead. Do you think they said “I’m gonna fly recklessly today�? No, they were not crazy loopers who were showing off. In fact, it is very interesting to me that nearly all the disasters we see in flying happen during what we would consider as “normal� flights. Folks just flying normally at their regular site. Its strange and quite worrisome. Sure, you’d expect to see people get hurt if they were flying thru the Gavina Bridge tunnel (as Dino has done successfully), or landing on a small island in the river-filled wash (as I did UN-successfully!), or top-landing Kagel (as I’ve done successfully 7 times), or looping their gliders. But often we see people get hurt just doing what they always do…doing what they consider to be normal, safe flight. Obviously, flying hang gliders is not safe. But it is worth it when you get to soar with the eagles. I just think it is important to realize the flying gliders is dangerous. And I think it is important to stop telling people “Its just as safe as driving a car�, because it is many many times more dangerous then driving.

Is the SHGA Board Of Directors going to release their own accident report on these two fatalities, including all the relevant info like: pilot experience, glider type, site conditions, and some recommendations on what we can do to avoid this in the future? I hope so.

Please consider flying safer. Please consider discusing safety issues more often. Please don’t fear the topic of accidents, its almost a forbidden topic in hang gliding, like if we really talked about it, we’d end up quiting and no new folks would ever join our great sport if the knew how gnarly it is. And I do understand that childish view, I’m a big kid myself. But I belive it is important to really look at ourselves and our sport, and see where there might be room for improvements. How many Hang IVs regularly ask an instructor to critique their take-offs and landings? I’ve done this many times, but I’ve rarely seen other “expert pilots� seek out the advice of instructors. That’s probably because they are afraid of hearing back that there is some room for improvement in their flying technique. I’d rather have my feelings hurt, then my body hurt, but that’s just me.

Anyway, those are just my thoughts, and I’m sure that, as always, most of you will totally disagree with me. But that’s OK…I’m used to it.

Some of my friends have mis-read my “I QUIT� letter, and they think I am quiting because I am now too scared of dying to fly. Nope. I’ve always found flying to be scarey, and I’ve always known you could get killed, and I’ve always had kids, and occasionally a wife. Nope. I’m quiting because it is not fun any more. Its just too “heavy�. The thought of my friends laying dead in the LZ takes all the fun out of it. As we stand around the LZ drinking beer, the blood of our friends soaks the grass at our feet. DAMN! I realize that doesn’t bother most of the pilots, but it really bothers me greatly. But hey…I’m a “sensitive artist-type�.

As an aside: When I used to go on flying trips to the Owens Valley, or Mexico, etc, I never brought an extra downtube with me. I figured that if I crashed and broke one, that missing some flying would help punish me into flying better and safer! Fortunately for me, only once in fifteen years of flying and 1,000 flights, did I ever bend a downtube (that was when I decided to top-land the 22, and I crashed really hard and also bent my leading edge). Even when I crashed in the wash, breaking both my arms in half…I didn’t bend a downtube or even damage my glider, I took all the force with my arms! As I said a few days later “A broken arm will heal…but a bent downtube is bent FOREVER!�. Sadly, I think some pilots took my advice to heart! Oh well, that’s one more reason not to listen to me!

What are your thoughts on all of this?

Gayle “Big Sissy� Ellett

PS: Remember: Where ever you go…the ground is hard!


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Glenn
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Post by Glenn »

I fully respect your decision for yourself, and agree with your advice to advanced pilots to reevaluate their level of airworthiness and the glider appropriate for them. That's not being a pussy, it's just smart.

On flying in general for me, I feel completely different. While I hope we never see another serious accident, I know that's not realistic. It could even be me. I'm OK with that. If we as a species stop doing everything dangerous what would we do? I've thought about it a lot, almost every day. I'm not especially brave but, I've decided I'd rather die than not live. It's that simple. Living includes risk, like it or not. It's just what level each of us is comfortable with. Its seems lately that the risk is very high and we need to seriously look into that, but it was 26 clean years before that with multiple flights every day. If 26 years had 2 fatalities with an average of maybe 10 flights a day, 350 days a year. That's 26*10*350/2 = 1 fatality / 45,500 flights. That's 45 lifetimes of your 1000 flights. Also remember that the number would be much much better if not for the recent tragedies.

The important question for me is: were these accidents just a coincidence or has something changed in the LZ we are missing?

I'm not disagreeing with you at all Gayle, In fact I agree with almost everything your said. What risk you are comfortable with is entirely your calculation, and it's personal and unassailable. We each will have to decide for ourselves. Like you I hope our pilots will reflect on the seriousness of this endeavor and fly appropriately.
Flyyyyy
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stebbins
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Post by stebbins »

Wow. Gayle and I don't agree on much, but we sure agree on this stuff.

While his choice to quit isn't mine, I certainly understand it. But it is a very personal thing, as stated previously.

On the other hand, all the comments about safety are pretty much right on. We aren't all as safe as we like to think. Yes, some are safer than others, but the instant you start thinking that safer means safe, you are at bigger risk. The ground is hard. Landings are hard. We need to get better at them. The only way to get better is to practice a lot with the right feedback (instructor, video, etc.) Flying slowly near the ground is risky. Flying impaired (sick, tired, hung-over, under the influence) is risky. Etc. All that said, there is still some risk of dying no matter how safe you are. So let's lower that risk as much as possible.

If Gayle and I can agree on something, that's a pretty good indicator that it is at least approximately true.

Please fly safely my friends.
Fly High; Fly Far; Fly Safe -- George
jcflies
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Post by jcflies »

i'm posting too much, i know it. i promise to absolutely shut up once i can fly again.

anyway, i just wanted to respond to something you said gayle. you said that no one goes out and says, "i'm going to be reckless today," but, by the same token, you never hear anyone say, "I'm going to do an absolutely precise, focused, attentive approach and landing for 9s today," either. if more of us thought that way, less of us would be sitting here posting instead of flying...
janyce

"You HAVE to make it..."
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stebbins
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Post by stebbins »

Wow. Gayle and I don't agree on much, but we sure agree on this stuff.

While his choice to quit isn't mine, I certainly understand it. But it is a very personal thing, as stated previously.

On the other hand, all the comments about safety are pretty much right on. We aren't all as safe as we like to think. Yes, some are safer than others, but the instant you start thinking that safer means safe, you are at bigger risk. The ground is hard. Landings are hard. We need to get better at them. The only way to get better is to practice a lot with the right feedback (instructor, video, etc.) Flying slowly near the ground is risky. Flying impaired (sick, tired, hung-over, under the influence) is risky. Etc. All that said, there is still some risk of dying no matter how safe you are. So let's lower that risk as much as possible.

If Gayle and I can agree on something, I'd wager that means that it is at least thinking about.

Please fly safely my friends.
Fly High; Fly Far; Fly Safe -- George
JT

Post by JT »

you never hear anyone say, "I'm going to do an absolutely precise, focused, attentive approach and landing for 9s today," either.
Janyce: You may never hear anyone say it but I'd venture a guess that, as I do, nearly everyone thinks it sometime after launch. I visualize my approach every day I fly and sometimes when I'm driving down the 405 (and you thought flying was scary). That isn't to say that I get it right every time. I don't but I keep trying to make the markers of a good launch and landing second nature.

If launch and landing isn't on your mind when you're near your glider, you're an idiot and a fool.

On Gayle's quitting: I agree that having friends die is depressing; I'd venture I've experienced more than many of you, in and out of this sport. But would I stop driving, if my friends were killed in a car accident? I had a friend die in his sleep when I was 10. I didn't stop making friends or going to sleep. I think it's a matter of degree, what we perceive as a "normal" way to die.

Gayle is correct that, no one should fool themselves into thinking that they are safe while flying. No matter what skills and experience, there is still the matter of that bubble of air around us. It doesn't care that changes may adversely affect whatever creature is within. We can only mitigate the effects, although, sometimes, they are overwhelming. Mistakes are not just unforgiven, they are irrelevant to the medium we navigate.

However, my feeling is that one lives with the risk of death every moment that one is breathing. I choose not to be ruled by "what if?"

I find that fear too scary.
jcflies
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Post by jcflies »

"If launch and landing isn't on your mind when you're near your glider, you're an idiot and a fool."

Jim, i agree with everything you've said, and i'm not talking about the elite moyes boys here--it's clear to me that you all think very clearly about all features of your flights.

but i think, sometimes, those of us with less experience put more of our focus into FLYING than LANDING. How else can you explain coming in too high? too low and still trying to carry out the "normal" approach pattern? too slowly? missing our spots? not seeing the other guy who's landing until you are both staging?

all of these problems indicate a kind of laxity in flexibility, focus, problem solving, pre-planning, and precision. the equivalent in driving a car means an accident or, at the very least, a lot of cursing, horn honking, and flipping off.

i'm guilty of some of these mistakes and i've had months to think about how/why i made them and, i don't know if anyone else out there is as foolish and/or idiotic as i am, but i know that most of my bad landings can be attributed to "letting down" before i've actually landed and unhooked. "This flight's over. God I have to pee and wasn't that thermal gnarly!," before I'm even on the ground, the result of having placed so much muscle, energy, thought (and joy) into interpreting the invisible medium we thermal in, that by the time i'm landing, there's not much left to work with.

i know now that landings require every bit as much attention as the rest of the flight and i have to budget accordingly. many of you are probably saying, in your most sarcastic voice, "DUH!!!"

but look at how many pilots mess up! how focused and precision-oriented can they be?

look at how many people say, "Well, I landed on my feet! So, it was a good landing." When it wasn't. It was too slow, or a sloppy approach. They just happened to be lucky, this time. I think some of us just get too complacent...We really need to step back and reflect on our ability and skills. What do we need to improve? How to set about doing it, whom to watch and pattern ourselves after, whom to ask for advice. Just because you have a particular rating or have been flying for a number of years doesn't mean you can't improve. Look at Olympians, they're driven to become better at what they do. A silver medal isn't good enough. It's that kind of mastery that we should all be seeking because anything less might KILL us!

That's why I think it's really important to have friends look at / judge our approaches and landings. (Solicited, mind you.) The last thing anyone wants is to have someone you never even see fly going on and on about your landing. You have to talk to pilots whose skills you respect.

Something to think about anyway, before you spend half a year recovering from a stupid mistake...IF you're that lucky...
janyce

"You HAVE to make it..."
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DrJeff
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Re: That's It I Quit... more thoughts from a big sissy...

Post by DrJeff »

[quote="Is the SHGA Board Of Directors going to release their own accident report on these two fatalities, including all the relevant info like: pilot experience, glider type, site conditions, and some recommendations on what we can do to avoid this in the future? I hope so....[/quote]

Dr. Jeff here. I just want to affirm Gayle's question above. We need to learn from the details of any mistakes, even if they involve tragedy. For example, I saw one post that claimed Jeff came in at 30 mph with no deceleration, which does at least make you want to know the outcome of the coroner's report (heart attack?).

Everyone knows that I don't get to fly that much, but that actually keeps me thinking hard about my landings and launches all the way up the hill. In addition, I have been fortunate enough to have Greblo see many of my landings. Whenever he sees one, I ask him about it! And yes, he will say more than a few words in response, but I have greatly benefited from his analysis and I am a better pilot because of it.

I do hope we have the accident reports posted here so we can all learn from these tragedies. Gayle said that the more you fly, the stupider you get. I would paraphrase that and say, "The more you stop viewing each flight as an important educational training exercise, the less you learn and the stupider you get."

And, on one related tangent, consider NOT riding up the hill in the back of a pick-up. Why bother with safety at all while flying if you are willing to risk being thrown out of a truck at 65mph?

Fly safe, high, far, and keep learning!

Peace,
Jeff
Jeff Bjorck
www.purepiano.com ~quiet music to calm the heart in a noisy world~
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stebbins
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Post by stebbins »

A couple of comments:

Landing focus: There is an issue with mid level pilots that most folks don't quite understand. When you are a beginner, everything is new, so you focus on each thing you are doing as much as you can with limited experience. As you learn, you find that some of the stuff becomes "automatic". In one way, that's good, because it frees up limited mental/emotional/attentional resources for other things (like getting up, avoiding traffic, etc.) But the stuff that is "automatic" is only automatic in the most basic sense. As long as nothing changes, you do your approach the same and all is fine. That DOES give you time to watch for that guy who just sneaked in below you from locals. However, if there is something different about your approach or whatever, then you have an issue. (Eamples: you are a bit low/high, the sink/lift is stronger than anticipated, more cross-wind, extra turbulence, bladder full, etc..) You might be stuck in "habit" mode, letting the auto-pilot do the approach. It takes a LOT more practice to get to the point where you can switch from autopilot and back quickly and handle a bunch of distractions all at the same time. Practice that comes only with flying. Practice that comes only with doing more landings. I'm not sure I'm explaining this well, but in my opinion this kind of ability is the REAL reason someone should get a H4. If they aren't able to handle changes in circumstances like this, then they aren't ready. But then, I'm a cautious kind of guy who wants his friends to live forever and keep flying just as long. The key thing to remember is that you can do your approach on automatic, but if you do it that way all the time, you will eventually regret it. There is only so much mental attention each of us can handle at one time. Use it wisely. Don't worry about if you are going to land 50 feet short or long, if there are two other gliders landing with you. Don't worry about landing in the bushes if the alternative is landing in the rocks. Prioritize consciously, and let the autopilot handle the lower priority tasks. Top pilots have better autopilots AND are able to handle more things consciously also. But these are skills that CAN be learned, and they can improve your odds of safe flight quite a bit. But you have to make yourself do it, because once something is in the autopilot, it is hard to change it without deliberate effort. The good news is that because this is a mental skill, you can do some of the work while you aren't even flying. That gives you a chance to improve even while grounded!

Accident reports: I agree with the posts above. I'd love to see them. However, when there is a fatality, there are often privacy issues that are different than when the pilot can be there to approve information release. Families don't always make the same decisions about that stuff as pilots. The Coroner (or other govt. folks) often don't either. Sometimes things just take longer. But, if we can get this information, I think it would be very helpful to all of us. I'm willing to wait if that's necessary for correct information (Autopsy, etc.). If it isn't necessary, then sooner is better.
Fly High; Fly Far; Fly Safe -- George
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