Radio in the Gazebo?

gregangsten · Post by **gregangsten** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:14 pm

I have often thought that it would be good to have a 2M radio mounted in the gazebo locked on 147.555 with a couple speakers mounted in the rafters. It seems to me that it would make things more interesting for spectators and pilots alike and also make it a little more likely that a call for an outlanding or a request from a pilot to the LZ would actually be received. I know that it was done in the past and I know that there was some concern about bothering the neighbors but I don't see why the volume couldn't be low enough that that would not be an issue.

I've heard other pilots agree with me but at least one other has not so I am interested in what other pilots think of this idea?

Vrezh · Post by **Vrezh** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 3:11 pm

Yes.
(Unfortunately nobody seats there...)

Post by **Mike M** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:02 pm

The only problem is availability to and use of the radio by unlicensed users.
There is no way to ensure that the use is licensed if the radio in unmonitored.

Some may think that's not a big deal, but "Uncle Sugar" (FCC) thinks so.

Mike

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:33 pm

Isn't there some way to have an electronic lock? A passcode to access the system? Maybe the microphone could be locked away when a licensed user isn't monitoring?

I like the idea but I agree with Mike. It also has to be secured when we aren't around. Who will be responsible at the end of the day/beer?

skygeek AKA Seabass · Post by **skygeek AKA Seabass** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:43 pm

I vote yes I the idea is on a wish list that has been around for a couple of years. I am sure we could find a radio with the feature to lock and unlock the hand set with a code that only licensed members would use. Once we pass final inspection items like this and others will be discussed in more detail with a realistic plan.

skygeek AKA Seabass · Post by **skygeek AKA Seabass** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:58 pm

Jinks Jim

gregangsten · Post by **gregangsten** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:34 am

skygeek AKA Seabass wrote:Once we pass final inspection items like this and others will be discussed in more detail with a realistic plan.

For now I just wanted to see what people thought of the idea.
The simplest solution to the FCC problem is to just use it as a receiver without a microphone.

dhmartens · Post by **dhmartens** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:51 pm

Radio Monitoring would provide safety and entertainment value.

Here are the Midway(1976) Battle scenes with Charlton Heston monitering the radio.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OWxoMZH ... OWxoMZHErM[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzXgtodXoJg[/youtube]

Spitfire · Post by **Spitfire** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:15 pm

gregangsten wrote:
skygeek AKA Seabass wrote:Once we pass final inspection items like this and others will be discussed in more detail with a realistic plan.
For now I just wanted to see what people thought of the idea.
The simplest solution to the FCC problem is to just use it as a receiver without a microphone.

Perhaps we could have a set up with just the speakers and then whoever wants can plug in their own radio, therefore being responsible.

Then when someone comes in to land we can switch the radio for an ipod and play some dramatic music for added effect. Obviously I'm kidding about this but if speakers are going up, it might be worth seeing if they can also be used to play music (at a reasonable volume) in case it is needed in future.

JD · Post by JD » Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:18 pm

Crestline has a built-in 2-meter radio in their gazebo at Andy Jackson Airpark, with a speaker. In an emergency anyone is permitted to use 2-meter radio with or without a license. Cell phones are often useless up on Kagel. If there is a an emergency that requires medivac or search and rescue this is exactly the type of thing that can save a life.

Since when has not having a license ever stopped anyone from the SHGA from broadcasting while flying just as having a license has been no assurance of following the FCC regulations and broadcasting ID every ten minutes?

As it is, we are using a frequency that is in violation of the ARRL band plan and is therefore a violation of FCC regulations in the first place. Since nobody else uses 147.555Mhz, we should stick with it and the interference from the digital repeater is minimal.

In the interest of safety I think we should set this up using club funds and include a speaker.

I have often been tempted to leave a transceiver connected to a 1/2-wave antenna in my car and operating with the speaker up loud and where it can be removed through an opened window in an emergency. I like this other idea better.

My 2p worth,
DQ

BudRob · Post by **BudRob** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:32 pm

I also like the idea and will bring it up to the board of directors for a funding approval vote just as soon as someone gives me a detailed list of of items needed and the total costs. This list must also include some kind of locked box that can be bolted down. One last request - I must also receive the name of the person who will purchase the items and get the job done. Once I have this, I can assue you that it will get my (BOD) vote. The details regarding unlicenced transmissions can certainly be worked out later.

Busto · Post by **Busto** » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:40 pm

Can we hear what the pros and cons are and how they will effect the club.

I'm on the fence with this one. I know that DQ has pointed out some important information that could possibly sway members, but I would also like to take a good look at the things that can put us into an illegal situation.

So for those who have facts, please speak up.

JD · Post by JD » Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:04 pm

Busto wrote:....So for those who have facts, please speak up.

I saved somebody's life 4 years ago because I had a 2-meter radio in my possession and knew how to use it. Although I had my tech license, I didn't need it under this circumstance.

How many lives have been saved by little children calling 911 who were otherwise not allowed to use the phone?

How many buildings are equipped w/ fire alarms and fire extinguishers that nearly anyone can activate or use in an emergency?

We'd be fools not have this system in place. Since it could be turned up so anyone in the LZ could hear it, it just might help encourage proper radio etiquette by our pilots.

In fact it might even prod a few radio users to study and take the tech exam and get licensed. Imagine that?

Mike Blankenhorn · Post by **Mike Blankenhorn** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 7:12 am

NMERider wrote:Crestline has a built-in 2-meter radio in their gazebo at Andy Jackson Airpark, with a speaker. In an emergency anyone is permitted to use 2-meter radio with or without a license. Cell phones are often useless up on Kagel. If there is a an emergency that requires medivac or search and rescue this is exactly the type of thing that can save a life.

Since when has not having a license ever stopped anyone from the SHGA from broadcasting while flying just as having a license has been no assurance of following the FCC regulations and broadcasting ID every ten minutes?

As it is, we are using a frequency that is in violation of the ARRL band plan and is therefore a violation of FCC regulations in the first place. Since nobody else uses 147.555Mhz, we should stick with it and the interference from the digital repeater is minimal.

In the interest of safety I think we should set this up using club funds and include a speaker.

I have often been tempted to leave a transceiver connected to a 1/2-wave antenna in my car and operating with the speaker up loud and where it can be removed through an opened window in an emergency. I like this other idea better.

My 2p worth,
DQ

Ja, so let's end this circlejerk and find a way to DO this, those opposed/indecisive will find something else to be opposed to/indecisive about in no time!

Busto · Post by **Busto** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 7:23 am

Ja, so let's end this circlejerk and find a way to DO this, those opposed/indecisive will find something else to be opposed to/indecisive about in no time!

The last time our club used this approach, it bit us in the ass. So let's look into our options and do what is right. Opposed and Indecisive is a choice that should be looked into...not ignored.

DQ has the right understanding about the issue. There is a test for ham radio this Saturday at Huntington Hospital. Walk-ins are welcomed.

I support the rig being put in as long as it is legal, we respect the equipment and what it's purpose is for.

There is little doubt that it can possibly assist in helping a pilot in distress.

Mike M is right about bringing up his concerns with the FCC; fines are pretty hefty.

dhmartens · Post by **dhmartens** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 8:48 am

Some downsides would be continuous keying noise over the speakers or even 3rd party long conversations about mold abatement over the channel.

Mike Blankenhorn · Post by **Mike Blankenhorn** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 10:59 am

How about a sign stating applicable FCC rules and in big letters something about authorized personnel only, that way any rogue communicator's action cannot be blamed on the club. This is obviously not foolproof but we need to accept that.

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 4:25 pm

Whoever owns a HAM radio is responsible for proper use. To be legal, an unlicensed user must be accompanied, meaning near-enough to control the radio, by a licensed user, except, as Jonathan states, in case of emergency.

Since the club would be the owner/responsible user, the radio cannot just be left out, unmonitored, in a state that allows a transmission.

Who would care?

There are forces out there threatening to call the club and others to task for any perceived or real abusive or illegal activities. Some not members*, some are.

A $10,000 fine would be unhelpful to our goals.

So, again, a qualified voice of support for this idea long as it can be unobtrusively controlled. If the control has to be too heavy-handed - a safe bolted to the foundation with CCD monitors, vibration detectors and bio-metric lock - it probably isn't worth the trouble. Unprotected isn't worth the trouble either.

Let's let our more tech-savvy members work on this and see what's available before everyone gets all fired up about it.

* Remember the frequency jamming a few years ago? We had something like that going on again on Sunday. Illegal, too, but he thinks he's the sheriff, keeping unlicensed rogues from using his medium.

Busto · Post by **Busto** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 5:17 pm

If someone is frequency jamming...they are no better. Infact, they are worse.

Illegal, too, but he thinks he's the sheriff, keeping unlicensed rogues from using his medium.

So do we have a name or motive? or are we speculating?

I'm not concerned about their reason of why they are jamming, but I am concerned about their prevention of what might be an important message.

skygeek AKA Seabass · Post by **skygeek AKA Seabass** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 7:25 pm

Its great to have all this information and ideas but now someone has to take the bull by the horns, gather all the technical information, find a make, model number, price that will work for us or call Crestline and find out what they have and how they deal with the radio issue. Rob will need this info to present to the board, with out it this project will go nowhere. I would contribute but my plate is all ready full with on going LZ projects.

Sylmar Hang Gliding Association

Radio in the Gazebo?

Should we have a permanent radio in the Gazebo?

Radio in the Gazebo?