The other side

[greblo]

Bob, you recently used my name in a post to Brad Hall on this forum. I would just like to make sure that from your post, people don't infer that I am supporting Jerry Katz for Regional Director when I am supporting Brad Hall.
Joe

[Bob Kuczewski]

Bob, you recently used my name in a post to Brad Hall on this forum. I would just like to make sure that from your post, people don't infer that I am supporting Jerry Katz for Regional Director when I am supporting Brad Hall.
Joe

Hello Joe,

I'm not quite sure if you are supporting Brad Hall (or opposing Jerry Katz). But I would like to be sure that this paragraph from my earlier post is correct as far as you are concerned:

13. You wrote: "Dave Beardslee came to me first with his suspension. I wrote up an agreement to get him back into the air quickly. I took it to the Mgt. and it was slightly modified. Dave could have been back in the air within a day or two. Bob stepped in and drug it out for a year. Any other comments should come from Dave, not Bob, who is not Daves legal voice." Brad, you know that you cooked up a gag order with David Jebb against David Beardslee that would have subjected Beardslee to even more severe restrictions if he spoke out in public about the things Jebb had done to him. Furthermore, you seem to have your due process backwards. The list of charges should come BEFORE the sentencing. You and Jebb wanted to skip that part and convict (and sentence) Beardslee without any of the due process that he deserved. You would not even request a written reason from Jebb for Beardslee's suspension. That's disgusting, and as a Regional Director you should have done better for Dave Beardslee. But we may agree on one thing - David Beardslee's opinion should be respected in this matter. Who do you think he supports in this election? Any guesses? I'll tell you. David Beardslee supports Jerry Katz and Rob Sporrer. He does not support you Brad because he knows the truth just as I do. Anyone who doubts that should just ask David Beardslee. If you can't get in touch with Dave Beardslee, try asking Joe Greblo. Joe was kind enough to sit down for an extended conversation with Dave Beardslee, and I think he can tell you who Dave supports (and who he opposes).

My mention of your name here Joe was in reference to our recent discussion with David Beardslee (October 23rd, 2009). I would prefer people to ask David Beardslee his opinion of Brad Hall vs. Jerry Katz, but since most Sylmar pilots don't see David Beardslee all that often, I thought you might be able to attest to his support of Jerry over Brad. I don't recall that being stated explicitly, but I think you could certainly come to that conclusion without much reservation. So if you could just affirm that based on our conversation it appears that David Beardslee supports Jerry Katz over Brad Hall, then that was all I was asking.

Thanks.

[greblo]

Bob,

I was careful to state my only concern about your post. I have no problem with your statement. I don't know what purpose that provides, other than using this forum to support your own lobbying efforts.

Joe

[Bob Kuczewski]

Hi Joe,

I'm just "answering the mail" on Brad Hall's statements...

"Dave Beardslee came to me first with his suspension. I wrote up an agreement to get him back into the air quickly. I took it to the Mgt. and it was slightly modified. Dave could have been back in the air within a day or two. Bob stepped in and drug it out for a year. Any other comments should come from Dave, not Bob, who is not Daves legal voice."

Since David Beardslee does not use a computer (or very very rarely), I thought it was important to document the fact that Dave Beardslee supports Jerry Katz. Brad Hall suggested that "Any other comments should come from Dave".

Well, I just called David Beardslee and I read to him what's been written on this forum. His answer? David Beardslee supports Jerry Katz and not Brad Hall. What does that say about Brad Hall's efforts on his behalf? Beardslee knows that Brad Hall conspired with Jebb to cook up a "gag order" on Beardslee so he couldn't tell the truth about how Jebb had treated him. If anyone doesn't believe me, then please call David Beardslee yourself. If you don't have his number, please call me (858-204-7499) and I'll be happy to give it to you.

As for the purpose it provides, Joe, ...

David Beardslee has lived through the hell down here that has resulted from the Regional Directors David Jebb and Brad Hall. He's been kicked out of his flying site and his livelihood. You haven't been here to see what has happened. You haven't watched Brad Hall turn his back on pilots and on hang gliding just to kiss David Jebb's back side. You don't know Brad Hall like Beardslee and I have come to know him. So the purpose is to provide Sylmar pilots (Region 3 voters) with the truth about Brad Hall through the eyes of those who've seen him firsthand.

Bob,

I was careful to state my only concern about your post. I have no problem with your statement. I don't know what purpose that provides, other than using this forum to support your own lobbying efforts.

Joe

[Bob Kuczewski]

By the way Bob, you were asked the "40 questions" about your club well over a year ago, and have not answered one. What are you afraid of?

Let's go Brad. What was your first question? The election will be over in December, so don't dawdle.

Rise to the challenge or slink away as you have in the past.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Brad,

It's been nearly two days now since I asked you to post the first of your 40 questions. At this rate it will be 80 days before we can get through them ... and the election will be over.

So let me make another suggestion. Let's talk about actual issues. I have several issues that I'd like to get USHPA to support:

1. Accountability Amendment - This is my proposal that the USHPA Board should adopt a set of procedures (nominally Robert's Rules Revised) for our meetings, and that we use open (roll call) voting when requested by any single Director. I have stated that I would be willing to support variants (like requiring two Directors instead of one). One of the members in our Region has asked you if you supported this, and he reports that you do not support it. Can you explain yourself on this matter? Thanks.

2. Adding Hawks to the Torrey Pines Soaring Council - This is my proposal that USHPA support adding the Torrey Hawks Hang Gliding Club to the Council. As you know, the current Soaring Council has 7 member clubs. Three of those clubs are RC clubs, and 2 of those clubs are sailplane clubs. That leaves only two representatives for BOTH sports of hang gliding and paragliding (essentially one each). This is very under-representative of the uses of that park. The Torrey Hawks Hang Gliding Club has been asking to be added for over 2 years (and throughout your entire time as USHPA's representative to that Council). I think that if all of our local Directors (you and I) were to agree to add the Hawks, then the other USHPA Directors would tend to support our local decision (that has been their stated policy). So will you offer your support to add the Hawks to the Soaring Council so we can increase our total HG/PG representation from 2/7 to 3/8? Thanks.

3. Due Process - I would like to see all of our pilots be granted due process at all of our sites. Fortunately, most club sites and most business sites have conflict resolution policies which provide for this. However, during recent conflicts, you have not supported any form of due process for our pilots. Are you willing to change your position on this, and would you outline for us the type of conflict resolution / due process that you feel is appropriate in various circumstances (it need not be one-size-fits-all)? Thanks.

Finally, I have spoken with Jerry Katz about these issues, and I believe that he supports all three of these ideas. Can you tell us why we should vote for you if you will not support these simple goals?

Bob Kuczewski

[Brad Hall]

Bob,
As can be clearly seen, you never put anything in the trash file. You know exactly which 40 questions I refer to, and you had plenty to say about me asking them at the time, but nothing in the way of an answer. This bait game you are so fond of is more telling of you as a RD than any answer you choose to hide from. The questions were asked in public and you have dodged them for over a year. Do your own homework.
Your so called accountability amendment does not even exist at this time. You know full well that it is not passed or decided by any poll or posting you do on web sites. The committee procedure must be followed and a discussion by the full RD Board, followed, possibly, by a vote. I will wait to see the doc. that is presented for a vote. By the way, including your failed proposal (17 against, 2 for), name one vote ever taken by the BoD that was not posted in the minutes for all to see. Any member can ask his RD how he voted any time he likes. Name one RD that has ever hid his vote from the membership. It simply is not an issue for anyone but you.
The TPSC has explained to you, how many times?, that they do not intend to add your club to the membership list. The USHPA told you, how many times?, that they will not support your efforts to add your club to the TPSC. You efforts to force your club onto the TPSC, through the USHPA, failed miserably. Name one issue (ever) that was voted upon by the TPSC that would have been different by the addition of your club. You have gone out of your way to portray me as "being removed from the TPSC" because I did something wrong. This is an outright lie and you well know it. Show me any proof to your accusations. You can't do it. The TPSC does not want anything to do with your unwelcome effort. They have told you just that time and again. You just refuse to hear it. You jumped for joy when a member of your club was appointed to fill my chair. Tell me, what has changed on the soaring council since then? Now that I am gone have they embraced you? Didn't think so. Of course, you have all the documentation in your files, you just choose to ignore it because you disagree with the answer.
The TPSC has told you in no uncertain terms that they will not be the body for conflict resolution at Torrey Pines. Read their bylaws again. You cannot force the TPSC to change its policy to fit your needs. Despite the fact that they are not obliged to resolve your conflicts, you were offered a professional resolution process by the TPSC and turned it down. Re write history any way you want, but the fact remains you were offered help and refused it because you wanted it on your terms only.
Now I am done answering any more of your questions. They are nothing new and your motives are transparent. Once again, you are not on the ballot. If Jerry would like to have a civilized and informed discussion, without your input, I welcome it.

[Bob Kuczewski]

OK, Brad. If you don't want to ask me any of your questions, then let me ask you some of mine. I'll start with the Accountability Amendment.

Here's my proposed amendment:

=================================================
[Article VIII, Section 13.] Conduct of Meetings:

All meetings (including Board of Director Meetings, Committee Meetings,
General Membership Meetings, and others) shall be governed by Robert's
Rules of Order Revised unless otherwise provided for in these By-Laws
or listed specifically below:

(a) In accordance with one of the practices discussed in Robert's Rules of
Order Revised, a Roll Call vote (Yeas and Nays) shall be taken if requested
by any Director. The names and votes of all Directors during any such Roll
Call vote shall be included in the minutes of the meeting for distribution to
the general membership.
=================================================

I discussed it with Dave Wills of the Organization and Bylaws Committee on September 4th, and I sent a copy to the entire Board on September 5th. It has remained unchanged since that time. There is a copy of it along with discussion, a list of supporting Directors / candidates, and links to other discussions at:

http://www.hanggliding.org/wiki/USHPA_Secret_Ballots

Brad, will you support this as is? And if not, then what changes would you like to see for this measure to gain your support?

You are correct that the proposed amendment needs to be reviewed by the Organization and Bylaws Committee before being brought to the full Board. But whatever the Committee brings to the Board can be changed by the members of the Board. So if any version comes through to the full Board you would have the ability to suggest modifications and vote on them. Even if this measure were completely changed by the committee, you could vote to change it back. So the two previous questions remain valid: Will you support this as is? And if not, then what changes would you like to see for this measure to gain your support?

Thanks in advance for your responses.

Bob Kuczewski

Bob,
As can be clearly seen, you never put anything in the trash file. You know exactly which 40 questions I refer to, and you had plenty to say about me asking them at the time, but nothing in the way of an answer. This bait game you are so fond of is more telling of you as a RD than any answer you choose to hide from. The questions were asked in public and you have dodged them for over a year. Do your own homework.
Your so called accountability amendment does not even exist at this time. You know full well that it is not passed or decided by any poll or posting you do on web sites. The committee procedure must be followed and a discussion by the full RD Board, followed, possibly, by a vote. I will wait to see the doc. that is presented for a vote. By the way, including your failed proposal (17 against, 2 for), name one vote ever taken by the BoD that was not posted in the minutes for all to see. Any member can ask his RD how he voted any time he likes. Name one RD that has ever hid his vote from the membership. It simply is not an issue for anyone but you.
The TPSC has explained to you, how many times?, that they do not intend to add your club to the membership list. The USHPA told you, how many times?, that they will not support your efforts to add your club to the TPSC. You efforts to force your club onto the TPSC, through the USHPA, failed miserably. Name one issue (ever) that was voted upon by the TPSC that would have been different by the addition of your club. You have gone out of your way to portray me as "being removed from the TPSC" because I did something wrong. This is an outright lie and you well know it. Show me any proof to your accusations. You can't do it. The TPSC does not want anything to do with your unwelcome effort. They have told you just that time and again. You just refuse to hear it. You jumped for joy when a member of your club was appointed to fill my chair. Tell me, what has changed on the soaring council since then? Now that I am gone have they embraced you? Didn't think so. Of course, you have all the documentation in your files, you just choose to ignore it because you disagree with the answer.
The TPSC has told you in no uncertain terms that they will not be the body for conflict resolution at Torrey Pines. Read their bylaws again. You cannot force the TPSC to change its policy to fit your needs. Despite the fact that they are not obliged to resolve your conflicts, you were offered a professional resolution process by the TPSC and turned it down. Re write history any way you want, but the fact remains you were offered help and refused it because you wanted it on your terms only.
Now I am done answering any more of your questions. They are nothing new and your motives are transparent. Once again, you are not on the ballot. If Jerry would like to have a civilized and informed discussion, without your input, I welcome it.

By the way, you mentioned:

By the way, including your failed proposal (17 against, 2 for), name one vote ever taken by the BoD that was not posted in the minutes for all to see.

There were two secret ballots in just the last USHPA Board meeting. One was on competition and the other was on adding the Torrey Hawks to the Soaring Council. And in neither case were the votes posted for all to see. They were secret, and so you could tell us you voted any way you like and we would have no way of knowing. Do you deny that there were two secret ballots taken at the Spring 2009 Board meeting?

[OP]

I'm a single issue voter.

For which two should I vote if I want Torrey to be raised to a H-5 rating?

[Bob Kuczewski]

For which two should I vote if I want Torrey to be raised to a H-5 rating?

Hi OP,

I don't think any of the three candidates would support changing Torrey to be an H5 site. It's already an H4/P0 site. If you made it an H5/P0 site you might just as well turn it into a paragliding only site!

------------------------------------------------------------
With regard to Brad's postings, I'd like to offer a few comments...

Brad Hall has a pattern of making diversionary statements like the one above where he throws everything but the kitchen sink into it. I have a response for each of his points, but if I reply in kind, then we'll just have a jumbled mess.

So my approach is to lay out all the issues (as I have) and then pick one at a time for careful methodical examination. That's how we can come to a solid conclusion on each issue rather than ending up with a shouting match. But Brad doesn't want to take that careful methodical approach because he knows he'll lose.

This is a fundamental distinction between us, and it has made it impossible for us to work together. I gave Brad the chance to pick any one of his "40 questions" for us to examine and he won't do that. So I've picked one current issue and he won't address that either.

Brad Hall is all bluster and bluff, and he's been bullying people with his pugnacious style for a long time. I don't put up with that, and I'll continue to ask specific questions about specific issues until he answers them. So when you see him try to dodge a simple matter - like whether USHPA Directors should cast public votes - you'll know that he knows you won't like his position. With Brad Hall, that might be as close as you'll ever get to a straight answer. That's another reason why I support Jerry Katz and Rob Sporrer. I'm asking all Sylmar pilots to give them your votes.

Thanks,
Bob Kuczewski

[katzflys]

Mr Hall, I do not know you and obviously you do not know me.
I have been flying since 1974 and do not need Bob to help me find credibility. I set two world records...distance and altitude gain, have flown in the Masters of Hang Gliding contest, regional and national
contests. I know the issues and believe I can help hang gliding continue progressing toward the future.
Bob's been asking some good questions, and I'd
like to know the answers myself. Brad?


Jerry Katz

[Brad Hall]

Mr. Katz,
I believe that was my point. Bob does not give you any credibility. I also believe I answered all 3 questions. What else would YOU like to discuss?
Bobs amendment is at this time merely a proposal to a committee chair. The TPSC has spoken and I am not the USHPA rep on that council,
The TPSC is not a courtroom and has done all it intends to do to help Bob with his problems. At least that is my understanding. I have not tried to disparage your viewpoints or marginalize your opinions. In fact, I have seen very little of your opinions and no answer to my questions to you. I am happy to engage you on issues. I have no intention of doing the same with Bob. He is not a candidate.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Brad Hall,

Jerry said he'd like to know the answers to my questions. You didn't answer them, you dodged them. Anyone reading your answers can see that you dodged them (try reading Brad's responses again to see what you think his answers are). So let me ask them again:

1. Will you support the Accountability Amendment? Yes? / No? / Yes with specific changes?

2. Will you support adding the Torrey Hawks to the Soaring Council? Yes or No?

3. Will you support due process for our pilots at sites like Torrey where there is a concessionaire and no club with authority? Yes or No?

In this election I am a voter. I am also one of your fellow Region 3 Directors. The fact that you are unwilling to answer simple questions or ask one of your "40 questions" or even have a dialog with me (as a voter or Director) demonstrates that you are not going to be cooperative with me as a USHPA member or as a fellow USHPA Director in the future. You were so loyal to David Jebb, that you can only see the world through his eyes, and that makes you unfit to represent the members of this region. Now you can continue with your current attitude or you can try to demonstrate some degree of cooperation by answering these questions as a Regional Director should.

Bob Kuczewski

P.S. Your comment to Jerry that "Bob does not give you any credibility" is another of your thinly veiled attempts to say that I am not credible. I believe I defeated David Jebb with more votes than any other Director in USHPA for many years. You backed David Jebb and you lost. So who has the credibility problem here? You've called me a liar above and yet you have not cited one example. Where's your credibility?

Mr. Katz,
I believe that was my point. Bob does not give you any credibility. I also believe I answered all 3 questions. What else would YOU like to discuss?
Bobs amendment is at this time merely a proposal to a committee chair. The TPSC has spoken and I am not the USHPA rep on that council,
The TPSC is not a courtroom and has done all it intends to do to help Bob with his problems. At least that is my understanding. I have not tried to disparage your viewpoints or marginalize your opinions. In fact, I have seen very little of your opinions and no answer to my questions to you. I am happy to engage you on issues. I have no intention of doing the same with Bob. He is not a candidate.

[OP]

I don't think any of the three candidates would support changing Torrey to be an H5 site. It's already an H4/P0 site. If you made it an H5/P0 site you might just as well turn it into a paragliding only site!
-BobK

It seems that such a site should warrent the elusive and little known H-7 rating. Open to those who have been gliding since 1891


While at the same time lower the parapente rating from P-0 to P-(-2). The P-negative two rating being those who are deaf, dumb, blind, unaware of the forces of flight and criminally insane.
It just seems that these rating changes are in line with the progression of the site.

[Bob Kuczewski]

It seems that such a site should warrent the elusive and little known H-7 rating. Open to those who have been gliding since 1891
:
While at the same time lower the parapente rating from P-0 to P-(-2). The P-negative two rating being those who are deaf, dumb, blind, unaware of the forces of flight and criminally insane. It just seems that these rating changes are in line with the progression of the site.

Sorry I'm so slow to get the joke. That's great!!

[OP]

from http://www.hanggliding.org/wiki/USHPA_Secret_Ballots


Bob,

It appears that Brad has in fact answered your 1st question. He is being reported by the above source as being against the amendment. Also it appears that opposition to the accountability amendment is slim.

[Bob Kuczewski]

from http://www.hanggliding.org/wiki/USHPA_Secret_Ballots

[Wiki Page showing Brad Hall's opposition]

Bob,

It appears that Brad has in fact answered your 1st question. He is being reported by the above source as being against the amendment. Also it appears that opposition to the accountability amendment is slim.

Good job of doing your homework OP!! You're sounding like Regional Director material to me. Maybe you can take my spot next year!!

The wiki page you listed shows what was reported by one Region 3 pilot who called Brad Hall and asked him the question. Now Brad could deny that he told that pilot anything, or Brad could feel that the simple Yes/No on that site didn't properly capture his position. So that's why I'm asking him here in person. I generally try to go to the source on matters like this, and I'm trying to be fair to Brad so he has a chance to explain himself on this forum.

Furthermore, there's always the hope that Brad will change his mind. If he were to post his position and then enter into a dialog with members on this site, then he might actually find himself changing that position. That would be even better because that way we might get the Accountability Amendment passed at the November Board meeting and not have to wait until the spring meeting (after Jerry Katz is elected).

And that brings up an important point. I would sincerely welcome Brad Hall's support on all of these items. They're all reasonable, and they're all what our Regional Director(s) should support. I don't hate Brad Hall, and I'm not intentionally trying to tear him down. But he has somehow painted himself into a corner where he's trying to defend indefensible positions. If he's going to stay in that corner then the only solution is to replace him with a more open-minded Director.

I'll go on to say that Brad ended up in that corner because he backed David Jebb and some of his indefensible positions. And in backing David Jebb, Brad saw me as his enemy, and he can't get past that viewpoint to see that I'm just a regular pilot who stepped forward to get fairness. If Brad could wipe away his bitterness and resentment, he could see that, and he'd probably find himself supporting all of these measures himself. But I can't just sit back and hope that will happen some time after the election. We have a chance to replace Brad now, and if we don't take it there's no guarantee that Brad won't be just as bitter and hateful for another 2 years. So as both a member and a Director of this Region, I don't want to take that chance.

Thanks again OP. I enjoyed your humor above, and I apologize that I don't recognize you from your initials.

Bob Kuczewski

[OSCAR]

Will you answer my questions Brad I would like to know1. Will you support the Accountability Amendment? Yes? / No? / Yes with specific changes?

2. Will you support adding the Torrey Hawks to the Soaring Council? Yes or No?

3. Will you support due process for our pilots at sites like Torrey where there is a concessionaire and no club with authority? Yes or No?

that's it thank you.

[Brad Hall]

Oscar,
As I said earlier, I will wait to see what the actual draft version, if any, the committee presents to the board for a vote (or not). The hypothetical amendment does not, in my opinion, represent a needed change. The President has the authority to call for a secret ballot when he/she deems it necessary. I have seen it used twice out of many votes, and I think it was a proper and viable way to address the issue at hand. It is a tool.
Any RD is free to disclose how they voted and the outcome of the actual vote is published on the USHPA web site. I do not know of one member that has ever asked (1) what was voted on at the BoD meeting?, and (2)
how did my RD vote on that issue?
2. No. I will not support adding the hawks to the TPSC. The council has its own set of bylaws which does not provide for the addition of another club to the existing group. There is a rep from the SDHGPA for both HG and PG, and a rep from the USHPA for both HG and PG. The council has stated it feels the sports are well represented. That is the councils choice, and no one has the right or authority to tell them otherwise. Apart from that, the club does not, as its name implies, represent the HG pilot community at Torrey Pines, and Bob in particular does not speak for that group of pilots.
3.Support due process? What do you mean? Change what the TPSC is and does despite the stated intention of the council to not become Bobs
"court of last resort"? Try to backdoor a club onto the council through the USHPA appointment process? The site is a City Park. The management is picked by the city through a RFP process, and a legal contract exists between the two. USHPA has no say in how the site is operated and does not even insure it.
Despite the picture that has been painted by a disgruntled few, the HG pilots at Torrey continue to fly and have a great time doing so. There is no conspiracy to kick out HGing. Ask the pilots that actually fly here, not the vocal few that complain about things based on web posts and never really experience the site themselves. Come on down and go flying.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Will you answer my questions Brad I would like to know

1. Will you support the Accountability Amendment? Yes? / No? / Yes with specific changes?

2. Will you support adding the Torrey Hawks to the Soaring Council? Yes or No?

3. Will you support due process for our pilots at sites like Torrey where there is a concessionaire and no club with authority? Yes or No?

that's it thank you.

Very good questions Oscar!!!

While we're waiting for Brad Hall to answer you, let's pass the time with a walk down memory lane. Many Sylmar pilots don't really know what kind of a Director Brad has been because Brad's done much of his work here in San Diego. As a San Diego pilot I've seen Brad's actions first hand for nearly 3 years now.

Let's start with Brad's letter from January 11th, 2008 (almost 2 years ago). At the time, the San Diego City Council was forming the Torrey Pines City Park Advisory Board, and they needed clubs to make appointments for hang gliding and paragliding representatives to that Council. Now the San Diego Hang Gliding and Paragliding Association (SDHGPA) would be a natural choice for paragliding because most of their club is made up of paraglider pilots (their President, Vice President, and most of their Board Members have been paraglider pilots for many years). They've also been friends of the concessionaire, David Jebb, and they tried to appoint David Jebb's own son Gabe to represent them on the Soaring Council. That's fine, and that makes them a good representative for one group of pilots at Torrey (mostly the paragliding pilots). But they would not be good representatives for all hang gliding pilots, and they would certainly not be good representatives for hang gliding pilots who wanted to see some changes at the Gliderport. So, as President of the Torrey Hawks, I applied to have the Hawks chosen to represent the sport of Hang Gliding on the Advisory Board. Fortunately, San Diego City Councilwoman Donna Frye felt that it was important for the Board to be inclusive and to contain a balance of views, so she motioned to add the Hawks and her motion was passed by a unanimous vote of the San Diego City Council.

But Brad Hall didn't want the Advisory Board to be inclusive and balanced. He only wanted Jebb's views (as represented by the SDHGPA) to be on that Board. So on January 11th, he sent the following email message to City Councilwoman Donna Frye (with a copy to SDHGPA club President David Metzgar) trying to convince her to change her position. You'll note that Brad used his title as USHPA Regional Director when writing that letter. You'll also note that he was writing against one of USHPA's own Chapters (the Torrey Hawks - USHPA Chapter #270). Most importantly, this was a secret message. Brad Hall did not include myself (as President of the Hawks) in his message (I was not a Regional Director at that time). In fact, when I asked Brad if he had written such a letter he refused to answer (just as he has done on this forum). I asked him repeatedly in different venues and he would not divulge this letter. Eventually, I went to San Diego City Councilwoman Donna Frye herself, and she was very open and gracious in sharing this information with me.

So when you read this letter, you should be thinking about what kind of a Regional Director would write a letter like this to a City Councilwoman and then not have the character to share it when asked. Furthermore, you should wonder if Brad Hall didn't like any one of you (or your club) would he take this kind of action behind your backs? And if he did, how would you ever know?

From: Brad Hall
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 2:54 PM
To: Frye, Donna
Cc: Metzgar, David Dr. CTR NHRC
Subject: Torrey Pines Advisory Board vote

Hello Donna,

My name is Brad Hall. We met at the birthday party I organized for LeRoy Grannis. I am a Regional Director of the United States Hang Gliding and Paragliding Association, a national organization that represents all pilots of both disciplines. I was informed this morning that a vote was taken and passed to appoint Mr. Kuczewski or one of the members of his club, the Torrey Hawks, to the advisory board. This is, in my opinion, a very bad idea. The " Hawks" do not represent the hang gliding community in San Diego, and the pilots that fly at Torrey Pines. Mr. Kuczewskis' stated and published goal is to obtain the lease at Torrey Pines. The members of his so called club are trolled for on the web or recruited at various other flying sites in So. Calif., often through divisive or unfounded half truths about the current situation at Torrey Pines. There is no documentation whatsoever that shows his membership list or the qualifications of said pilots to fly at Torrey Pines. This in spite of repeated requests from the Torrey Pines Soaring Council. He has no standing at Torrey Pines or any other flying site. The San Diego Hang Gliding and Paragliding Assn. has represented the pilot community in San Diego for over 30 years and would be the logical and qualified entity from which to choose a representative for this board. The USHPA and the SGHGPA do not discriminate against either form of flight, and in fact work together to unify both flight disciplines. What ever wing the pilot chooses to fly makes no difference in the operations of the flight park. The same rules apply equally to both. To separate them would be like having a longboarder and a shortboarder pitted against each other at a break that permits both. No one wins. If this new board is to have any credibility it would seem prudent to appoint a pilot that would work toward equality and that does not have a history of antagonism toward the current concessionaire. There are many more knowledgeable and reasonable pilots that also possess a high degree of ethics who would serve this board far better.

Just to clarify that I know what I am speaking about, I will give you a little information on myself. I have flown hang gliders at Torrey Pines for over 30 years. I was the founder of the Torrey Pines Hang Gliding Assn and served as its president for several years. I signed the original special use permit for Torrey Pines and insured all requirements were met with the City of San Diego to keep the site open and safe. I wrote the original rules for flight which are little changed to this day. I have many hundreds of flight hours at Torrey Pines and have dealt directly with every concessionaire since the first on signed on. I am the USHPA Representative to the Torrey pines Soaring Council. I have seen many come and go with differing agendas for the site and can say that Mr. Kuzewski is no friend of Torrey Pines.

I would be happy to discuss my viewpoints with you at any time.

Please feel free to call me at (760) 525-0210 or email at the address below. I am asking for your help and guidance to rectify this situation.

Thank You

Brad Hall

brad.reg3@gmail.com

[Note, as shown by the time stamps on these postings, it appears that both Brad Hall and I were composing our responses at the same time. I'll address Brad's posting separately below.]