USHPA mailer re: donations for RRG

[JD]

....Alan, everything I've posted stands up well to scrutiny. That's why my testimony was so powerful. It was accurate and truthful....

Spoken like a real American hero!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS9blbLrKv4[/youtube]

My apologies to Martin Shkreli. I have to admit this wasn't fair to him.

[Bob Kuczewski]

No one can accuse me of being "pro-Tad", and he's been banned from our forum since about this time in 2011. If you read his forum, he's got a whole topic devoted to tearing me down. But Tad is a smart guy, and he reads a lot. He also reads through a lot of the smoke that people blow. Here's a recent post of Tad's addressing Jonathan's earlier comments. I removed some of the foul language and inserted attribution to some of the quotes and added some underlining. Here's a link to the original http://www.kitestrings.org/topic33-720.html#p8841.

NMERider - 2015/12/19 06:48:54 UTC

According to my recollection of the evidence presented for Bob Kuczewski's expulsion from USHPA he gave testimony under oath for which he was not qualified to give by any stretch of the imagination.

1. According to your RECOLLECTION? Why don't you just go to the transcript so's you don't need to RECALL anything? What? No transcript? Why do you think that is? If you were legitimately expelling someone from the organization wouldn't you want a transcript to document the necessity and fairness of the proceedings?

2. Wasn't qualified by any stretch of the imagination?

Robert Kuczewski - 81898
- H4 - 2005/09/13 - Steve Stackable - 2012/09/30 - FL AWCL CL FSL RLF TUR
- P4 - 2006/04/11 - Ken Baier - FL CL FSL HA RLF RS TUR

- Looks pretty f...'n qualified to me. He got those ratings from u$hPa, right? And if he's got those Advanced ratings in both flavors and he's not qualified then that in itself is a damned good case against u$hPa's legitimacy.

- And how many of the a**holes on the [USHPA] Board who backed Bob's expulsion for giving unqualified testimony were as qualified as Bob was?

- Think Bob might have presented his rating card to the court and that the court determined that he WAS in fact qualified by some stretch of the imagination to give testimony under oath?

3. So if Bob was giving false testimony under oath how come I haven't heard any mention of the word "perjury"?

4. Wanna hear some false testimony regarding Shannon's situation from a Gliderport pilot at the time of the incident?

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7623/1717 ... 91b5_o.png
[Picture of Torrey Pines instructor Brad Geary in the air placing a phone call to Shannon's husband]

Brad Geary - 2011/07/24

Shannon had a minor accident. ... I don't know details - I saw it from the air...

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5462/1720 ... 445a_o.png
[Picture from video showing Brad Geary standing on the ground watching Shannon's accident]

In effect, Bob betrayed over 9000 UHSPA members in furtherance of his personal spat against the Jebb family and in the process helped place the sports of hang gliding and paragliding in permanent jeopardy.

1. Not all nine thousand members of that s*** organization feel that way, Jonathan. A pretty good chunk of the people involved in the discussions were outraged by u$hPa's conduct - including some who were no fans of Bob's by any means - and many declared they'd be dropping their memberships in protest.

2. The Jebb family is ultra corrupt dangerous scum.

3. Bob HELPED place the sports of hang gliding and paragliding in PERMANENT jeopardy? Pretty damned good for one person not qualified by any stretch of the imagination to give testimony in a paragliding incident case. [comments about an unrelated incident removed]

Bob should do the honorable thing and go into permanent hiding.

Yeah? So cite something from Bob's testimony that had no legitimacy and tell me why u$hPa's top notch, highly qualified hang glider pilot attorney was totally unable to discredit Bob to the satisfaction of the court.

Bob Kuczewski - 2015/12/19 17:55:17 UTC

According to my recollection of the evidence presented for Bob Kuczewski's expulsion from USHPA he gave testimony under oath for which he was not qualified to give by any stretch of the imagination.

False. My testimony was solid because it was true.

I'd say if there's a midair which seriously injures a P! student flying in traffic at a Hang Four minimum soaring site while she's under active instruction by a flight school that's about 500.0 percent the fault and responsibility of the flight school. And it sounds like the court reached the same conclusion.

[JD]

No one can accuse me of being "pro-Tad", and he's been banned from our forum since about this time in 2011. If you read his forum, he's got a whole topic devoted to tearing me down. But Tad is a smart guy, and he reads a lot. He also reads through a lot of the smoke that people blow....

Tad's Bob Show forum topic isn't devoted to tearing you down Bob any more than your testimony for which you were expelled was factual and truthful. A good deal of what he posts in that thread is in your favor. Anyhow I enjoy reading Tad's posts and corresponding from time to time. On occasion I post on Kitestrings as well. Anyhow Bob, I wish you well and I wish you Bon Voyage. Feel free to post anything and everything you like on USHawks.org. Have at it!

[Bob Kuczewski]

Neither Alan's nor Jonathan's comments have anythng to do with how the Sylmar club should participate in the RRG. I suspect that they're just commenting to muddy the waters.

Bob B's original question reminds me of another important point - ownership of the RRG. USHPA wants members to "donate" to the RRG. What does that mean - exactly?

There has been a mention that a number of organizations (including schools) will actually "own" the RRG. This raises the issue of the rights and responsibilities of an "owner" as compared to the rights and responsibilities of a "donor". Should the Sylmar club be a part owner of the RRG? If the Sylmar club were a part owner, would that give Sylmar better control of Sylmar's own site?

Then there's the commercial interests. It's my understanding that a few large schools will be contributing a large amount of money. Does that make them owners? And who are they? Is the Torrey concession an "owner"? And if so, what power does that give them over Sylmar? Is it possible that these schools are attempting to use USHPA's insurance program to gain more control of club-operated sites? It's my understanding that David Jebb (Torrey) tried to take over Dockweiler many years ago. Is it possible that they've got their eyes on Sylmar or Crestline? And if not them, then who else?

My whole point here is that Sylmar should be pooling Sylmar's money and using it wisely for the interests of Sylmar. USHPA has created a "divide and conquer" strategy where they ask individual pilots to donate directly - bypassing the Chapters altogether. Why?

Finally, I haven't heard a single legitimate argument against Sylmar pooling Sylmar's own money first. We've seen a lot of mud slinging in this topic in an attempt to suppress this idea (I was banned from Crestline for even suggesting it). But there hasn't been any solid reason I've seen anywhere as to why Sylmar shouldn't keep Sylmar's own money.

Jonathan? Alan?

[JD]

....(I was banned from Crestline for even suggesting it). But there hasn't been any solid reason I've seen anywhere as to why Sylmar shouldn't keep Sylmar's own money.

Jonathan? Alan?

Golly Bob,

Weren't you really banned from the Crestline forum for engaging in a series of personal attacks against Alan (AIC)? Are you even capable of making a factual statement or is this something that's not even an option for you? Not to change the subject but weren't you also the star expert witnesses in the McMartin preschool trial? It wouldn't surprise me if you said your were. Anyhow, once the Jebb's take over the Dockweiller, Sylmar and Crestline clubs then I guess I'll get going on my kiting skills and have that P0 started.

Your Very Good Friend and Admirer,
Jonathan

[Bob Kuczewski]

Weren't you really banned from the Crestline forum for engaging in a series of personal attacks against Alan (AIC)?

No ... and you know it.

Are you even capable of making a factual statement or is this something that's not even an option for you?

I think I've seen this movie before, and I'm not taking your bait. This topic is about USHPA's RRG scheme and whether pilots should donate to it, or not donate to it, or take some other action.

If you want to make false statements to goad me into some kind of flame war, please pick another forum.

As far as this topic goes, I haven't seen any substantive reason given as to why Sylmar pilots shouldn't pool their money locally with the possibility of either passing the donations on to the RRG or participting in the RRG as an owner. By pooling money locally, both options are open. But pilots sending money directly closes off the possibility of Sylmar money supporting Sylmar's participation.

As a side note, did you know that the Green Bay Packers are the only non-profit, community-owned major league professional sports team in the U.S.? The Green Bay Packers don't pack up and move to Indianapolis or Saint Louis in the middle of the night because they are owned by the people of Green Bay. The NFL wouldn't allow that today, but the people of Green Bay Wisconsin had the foresight to lock in that deal when they had the chance. Now is the time for Sylmar to do the same - before USHPA brainwashes your members to send in their money with no ownership or control.

[JD]

....This topic is about USHPA's RRG scheme and whether pilots should donate to it, or not donate to it, or take some other action....

I see Bob. It's a "scheme". Kind of like Bernie Madoff, where the early contributors to the RRG get their liabilities paid out by the donations of the later members? Why not just call it the USHPA Ponzi Fund? Or will this be the "scheme" where Torrey and Kitty Hawk pony up 50% of the fund corpus but get 99% of the actual liability coverage? If this sums up your consternation then I guess I've done a good job of standing in your Florsheim's and can look at life through the same -15 diopter Foster Grants after all. With me you get symphony.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Tangent Man (Jonathan Deitch?), I don't own any "Florsheim's" or "-15 diopter Foster Grants".

I do own a good bit of common sense, and I've noticed you've dodged my suggestions that Sylmar members should donate to a Sylmar fund. My common sense tells me there's a reason you've dodged that question.

Sylmar members, USHPA hatched this RRG scheme without any discussion of what it means to be a "donor" or an "owner". It seems that they want to use your donations to help fund a pile of money to be owned and controlled by the people who've caused this mess.

USHPA wants you to commit to launching without assessing the conditions first. They're trying to create panic because people don't think well in a state of panic.

If you want to show your dedication, pledge your money to Sylmar to use in negotiating a good deal for Sylmar. That helps empower the Sylmar club. Every dollar you give directly to USHPA helps castrate the Sylmar club.