Elsinore Turkey Meet

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 7:59 pm

(message forwarded) from John Kerry:

"Turkey meet Elsinore Nov 28th, Bruce Carr benefit. Hand blown glass trophies by everyday mike. Hang - para head to head spot landing, bomb drop and duration. $25 entry $5 per car day use. The Marina West LZ is big and sandy right now. Greg Lunt Meet Director. Can the hangs beat the paras at spot landing. Extra prize for the best toe dip. There will be food."

We should all go! Bruce Carr had an in-flight heart attack and slammed in... It's been tough for him. He made the Mr. Death placards that some of us bought at the CSS fly-in LAST year...

jdevorak · Post by **jdevorak** » Wed Nov 18, 2009 3:20 pm

I'm interested. Will there be...power lines?

max · Post by **max** » Wed Nov 18, 2009 4:33 pm

I don't know if I want to go I hear cold turkey don't taste that good

OSCAR · Post by **OSCAR** » Wed Nov 18, 2009 5:35 pm

Cold Turkey--- Thats Cold

OP · Post by OP » Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:36 pm

John Kerry hang glides?

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jdevorak · Post by **jdevorak** » Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:35 am

Today (friday) is LAUSD substitute teacher appreciation day. I take back any teasing I've done of jcflies. She makes the LZ more fun.

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Fri Nov 20, 2009 4:38 pm

teasing's fine and DESERVED, but what i can't stand is that USHGA is coming after me NOW, 2 years after the fact, for the $1000 deductible. some months i don't even EARN $1000. the threat is that i'll lose my membership... so what am i supposed to do? sell my hang glider to pay them?

how many people do you guys know who had to pay for hitting a powerline? i can name 4 who never had to pay a cent!

JD · Post by JD » Fri Nov 20, 2009 5:43 pm

jcflies wrote:..............how many people do you guys know who had to pay for hitting a powerline? i can name 4 who never had to pay a cent!

Deductible? I didn't know there's a deductible on our liability policy. I better stop trying to emulate Tom Truax.

Sorry about your arrears billing Janyce. Would have been nice if they dunned you immediately to avoid this nasty surprise.

abinder · Post by **abinder** » Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:11 pm

jcflies wrote:teasing's fine and DESERVED, but what i can't stand is that USHGA is coming after me NOW, 2 years after the fact, for the $1000 deductible. some months i don't even EARN $1000. the threat is that i'll lose my membership... so what am i supposed to do? sell my hang glider to pay them?

how many people do you guys know who had to pay for hitting a powerline? i can name 4 who never had to pay a cent!

It may depend on the amount and type of damage done. Don't know, but just a thought.

Allen

John Kerry · Post by **John Kerry** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:32 pm

OP wrote:John Kerry hang glides?

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That's not me. But come to the Turkey meet anyway. You WILL have fun.

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:59 am

JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE TURKEY MEET IS ON SATURDAY, NOV. 28th.

Also, the entry fee is a $25 donation to Bruce Carr, checks payable to Bruce Carr. (He had an in-flight stroke or heart attack, slammed into a palm tree, followed by the ground.) We should all show our support!

LET'S GO!!!

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:47 pm

for many reasons, both financial and new-on-my-glider related, i couldn't go, but i think we're fairly well represented! sincerely hope everyone had awesome flights and safe landings! i also hope it all works out well for bruce!

JD · Post by JD » Sun Nov 29, 2009 9:53 pm

jcflies wrote:for many reasons, both financial and new-on-my-glider related, i couldn't go, but i think we're fairly well represented! sincerely hope everyone had awesome flights and safe landings! i also hope it all works out well for bruce!

Max kicked ass in the bomb drop and spot landings and came in second. I launched first with Richard Shaw on my nose and Max on my left wing. Malury won the award for youngest pilot. Ken was there too. Did I miss anyone? I was busy flying most of the day. It was windy and gusty on launch and I don't know how many assembled gliders were subsequently broken down on launch too. The winds never died back. Weather in the LZ was nice and shirt sleeves were enough until later. At altitude it got down to 40 degrees. LZ video is being rendered right now. I'll post tonight. Here's Dave Aldrich's keel cam video of his "Whack of the Day"

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrXIsHfgh0Q[/youtube]

rsherwoo · Post by **rsherwoo** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:18 pm

That looks like an easily avoidable whack! From the video, he was nice and level until he transitioned his hands from the base tube to the downtubes, which induced a small turn leading to the whack. I'm not sure why he had both hands on the base tube until the last 1-2 seconds? That could be an expensive habit.

JD · Post by JD » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:40 pm

rsherwoo wrote:That looks like an easily avoidable whack! From the video, he was nice and level until he transitioned his hands from the base tube to the downtubes, which induced a small turn leading to the whack. I'm not sure why he had both hands on the base tube until the last 1-2 seconds? That could be an expensive habit.

Rob,
Dave is one of the best landing pilots that I know. This was a real fluke for him. The problem was exacerbated when he released his right hand to reach for the other downtube while the glider was already banking to the left. He missed the right downtube and grabbed the rear wire instead. He tried to correct but it was already too late. There was no reason in the 15+ mph surface wind for Dave to even release his right hand from the base tube once his wing banked. He could have easily landed with one hand up and one down.

The problem as I see it is when you land 90% of the time at the same place in the same conditions that habits get so ingrained that when there's a radical change you will revert to old habits even if it's the wrong thing to do. It has happened to me more times than I can count. Please don't let it happen to you.
Jonathan

OSCAR · Post by **OSCAR** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:27 pm

To much left input .I looked at it frame by frame and it seems to me he was in a slight left turn when he released the base tube the nose pops up and he unintentionally swings left which initiated more left turn input just before he misses the downtube & grabs the rear wire .by the time he get his hand on the downtube and tried to correct the gliders locked into the turn and he is pushing out .I don't know if pulling in at the time he grabbed the rear wire might have helped or not seems like there is still enough altitude to level out .Thanks for posting it's good to see and learn from these accidents.

Hope your OK Dave.

JD · Post by JD » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:35 pm

jcflies wrote:judging by the wind over the lake, it looks like david was landing in a cross that was blowin'! rob mckenzie always says that your first line of defense is running it out, or a combination of flare/steps. in an x wind, it might not be such a bad idea! i wasn't there, though... i bet mitch pulled off whatever landing he did...

Dave landed nearly straight into the wind and did an improper hand transition followed by a blown hand transition. Ask Greblo for his comments on Dave's blown landing.

See Mitch blow his landing at 3:30 here.........
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k65vz377NCo[/youtube]

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:37 pm

judging by the wind over the lake, it looks like david was landing in a cross that was blowin'! rob mckenzie always says that your first line of defense is running it out, or a combination of flare/steps. in an x wind, it might not be such a bad idea! i wasn't there, though... (i bet mitch pulled off whatever landing he did!)

i think that NME has a point. we become so used to landing a certain way in a certain l/z that we lose sight of what we should be thinking/observing in an unfamiliar l/z.

hence the video that i posted from youtube 2006 of everyone messing up their landings at kagel in a north wind. (see the torrey debate)

JD · Post by JD » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:49 pm

jcflies wrote:..............i think that NME has a point. we become so used to landing a certain way in a certain l/z that we lose sight of what we should be thinking/observing in an unfamiliar l/z.

hence the video that i posted from youtube 2006 of everyone messing up their landings at kagel in a north wind. (see the torrey debate)

Greblo taught me that first lesson the day I showed up for my tandem refresher flight. That 2006 video was priceless and it does make the point quite well. Poor Fred! He really pounded in hard there.

jcflies · Post by **jcflies** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:08 am

my bad jonathan, when i watched the first vid you posted "Whack of the Day," the lines on the water at :20 through :23 looked like it was an x wind rippling across water. DOH!

the "2009 Turkey Meet" makes the wind direction clear enough.

guess mitch'll have to replace the entire "A" frame after THAT blown landing!