Let's Start Over - Gazebo, etc.

JT · Post by JT » Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:03 am

It was pointed out to me by Phil that I left out a favored option of some pilots when I started the Gazebo Madness poll. Looking back on the postings, it really was a good idea - it just didn't seem to have much to do with the gazebo. However, it is relevant since it might possibly be an alternative to the gazebo as part of an enhancement of the LZ environment. So, to complicate things a bit, I'll pose Phil and JB's suggestion and some reasoning why we should consider it before we decide on anything (I copied this out of an article that may appear in the newsletter). We'll call it the "clubroom" option for now.

One More Thing...
Another related idea is the new construction of an enclosed, covered area between the existing glider storage containers that may incorporate an observation deck. At the very least it could accommodate a bulletin board, a small office and dry space to hold clinics and ground school. Hard-core LZ fans would have a dry spot on inclement, no-fly days. Ventilation would be provided by sliding glass doors (screened) at each end and some form of roof venting. Electrical would provide lighting and power for electronics and even ceiling fans. The floor could be tiled.

Construction costs would be significantly less since there is already a foundation. It would be low-profile and not draw attention to its existence, mitigating the permit dilema.

So, now what does everyone think? I know this will split the vote up a lot but this is intended to gauge interest, not to make a final decision.

BudRob · Post by **BudRob** » Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:02 am

I like the idea of building something new before fixing something old, particularly because the gazebo isn't THAT bad yet. I want a place to get out of the wind and rain and initially I was thinking the gazebo could be rebuilt with that in mind.

I voted to do both. However using the existing space between the storage containers is a better use of the money if we can only do one, and should be done first if we can do both.

stebbins · Post by **stebbins** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:12 am

So we have decided not to ever have a third storage container? If we want an enclosed club house, why don't we build one in place of the gazebo? Then we combine costs and leave room for the third storage container. Just a thought, and I have no strong opinion about it. However, if we want to eliminate the possiblity of a third storage container where it was planned to go, then we should do it with our eyes wide open, not by accident.

Just one more reason we shouldn't rush into this. I'm all for fixing/rebuilding. I just want to make sure we know what we want before we do it.

Lucky 13 · Post by **Lucky 13** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 11:30 am

One thing that we won't have is the observation deck. It was a topic at the last meeting. As cool as it would be, it would create too much liability for the club. There will also be no "water tower". With this being said, the possibility of a deck on top of the water tower is also gone.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 1:29 pm

If the third storage container is a real possibility in the near future then I suggest getting the container now and use it as the clubroom structure until later when we convert it to storage. That would require, no construction, and it would be strong and secure. We could cut holes and install some skylights into the top for power free lighting.

Also rebuild or refurbish the gazebo. I checked it out Saturday and it does have some termite damage. but it's not exactly falling down.... yet.

Lucky 13 · Post by **Lucky 13** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:32 am

That's a really good idea. A third container as a room, with the possibility of being glider storage if it was needed. That would solve most construction issues. It's also not a permanent structure.

JBBenson · Post by **JBBenson** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:37 am

Didn't somebody already mention that? Modifying a container?

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:55 pm

Yes Mr. Benson, you did suggest the same container idea, but I suggested it last. You suggested it as a replacement for the gazebo. I'm suggesting that we install the container between the current ones right where it will go for glider storage and then conversion to that later will be easy. This would be in addition to a new gazebo, which I suggest we construct out of beer cans which are native and ubiquitous to the LZ area.

JT · Post by JT » Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:01 pm

A little info and my thoughts.
At the moment, there isn't a lot of demand for more storage; only more accessible tubes. I checked with Jay. So, another container for storage is not at the top of my list. A container to serve as a room, maybe. I think it will be a little more cramped and much hotter/colder than we would like, though.

If we do build a frame structure and later need more storage, we could easily remove the framing (Rome builds great fires with old lumber) and scavenge the useful parts (glass, fans etc.) for a new location (to be built with the funds generated by the new storage?).

How much does a used container cost?

Other opinions?

stebbins · Post by **stebbins** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:04 am

If we think we will be putting in a 3rd container later, then we should not spend much on anything that will get in the way. A roof maybe. Containers are expensive enough that we shouldn't buy one until we want it. And I agree that it might be hotter than we want inside one.

I'd like to see a roof over the empty container spot and a rebuilt gazebo. Maybe the gazebo could be bigger, or more like a club-house, but it should be at least partly open. It gets awfully hot in the summer.

Just my thoughts. I don't feel strongly about much of it except that we shouldn't shoot ourselves in the foot and pay for something that we will rip out in a year or two. Unless it is cheap enough to make that reasonable.

Don · Post by **Don** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:15 am

I thought there already was a sun canopy over at least part of the area between the existing storage sheds. I can't remember seeing anyone ever use the space (except ??? with the craps table) - but I've only been in the club 1 1/2 years

I only wish there was a need for additional storage sheds - that MIGHT indicate that the club is growing

JT · Post by JT » Wed Jan 24, 2007 7:01 pm

Time to bring this topic back to the top. No voters, lately.

A new thought: Chip was concerned that we shouldn't use any glass (sliders) in the construction to convert the space between the containers; too much chance that some of Dimmer's remnants might blow into it during a heavy-duty Santa Ana... or vandals might show up.

What if we include shutters? Like barn doors to protect the glass while it isn't occupied? I think we need to get light into this space. Skylights were mentioned as another possibility.

Comments?

People I talked to last Saturday seemed to think we might have appreciated a warm, enclosed space that afternoon. Time to vote your opinion.

JT · Post by JT » Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:05 pm

"Hi Jim!

Just a quick note before I forget..

I've been talking to the architect here about our gazebo project, and when I
mentioned we get 30-40 mph winds she was amazed that our existing structure
is still there. The secret is that the roof is mostly permeable to air, and
spills out when the dreaded uplift phenomenon occurs. So, our new gazebo, if
it is to be rain-proof, will have to have designed into it openings or louvers
that will allow uplift air to escape. Otherwise it will fly off into the
baseball field.

How's the gazebo team coming ?

Richard"

Note to Richard: No word on any team effort , yet.

Sylmar Hang Gliding Association

Let's Start Over - Gazebo, etc.

What do we build: Gazebo, Clubroom or Nada

Let's Start Over - Gazebo, etc.

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